Kay: Hello and welcome to the Now Why podcast. This is a space for our wonderful PRINT® coach facilitators, coaches and people developers to talk about all things PRINT®. So today in the PRINT® hotseat, we've got Rachel Martin. Rachel is a team facilitator and executive coach. She has a vast experience of the transformative impact of PRINT® on individuals and teams. Since 2015, she's been an accredited PRINT® coach, helping people understand themselves and colleagues in a deeper and more meaningful way. Rachel's multi-sector experience includes over 15 years of working in the university sector. As a senior lecturer, she has held post-graduate programs in leadership, coaching and wellbeing. I'm delighted to welcome Rachel to the hot seat today.

Hi Rachel, how are you and welcome to the Now...why? podcast.

Rachel: Hi Kay and thank you for inviting me to speak on the podcast. It's very exciting

Kay: Oh, it's an absolute pleasure. So the question that I ask everybody, first of all, to get us going is tell me about the first time that you encountered PRINT® and the impact that it had on you.

Rachel: Well it was about, as you actually achieve alluded to, it was about ten years ago now. So I've become very familiar with PRINT® over the years, and I was fortunate enough to be invited to become accredited and do the training, and I thoroughly enjoyed it. I thoroughly enjoyed it. At that time I thought, there's a place for this. I enjoyed it personally, but I knew professionally there would be an opportunity with PRINT®. And I suppose receiving the PRINT® report just really shines a light on who you are. It's probably, quite a scary reflection in some ways when you're looking at your shadow self, but actually equally celebrating your best self, I think, is really important. So for me, recognising my, place in terms of being a coach, being a people developer and actually supporting others, was really my dominant unconscious motivator. So being needed and appreciated, liking to support others, to listen to others, to be empathic towards others. So the best self aspect really, really resonated for me. And, and also the element around sort of standards around being perfect, correct and right was a minor unconscious motivator. But really taking what I do in my job professionally, as a lecturer, coach and facilitator really seriously. And I think probably a reflection was that I have got very high standards. I know that, but I think it really sort of demonstrated that back to me in terms of the narrative. And really being driven as well by providing excellent customer service. And, and that's partly driven by my first career before being in the university sector and education sector in the retail sector for ten years. So sort of customer service was also a place that I really enjoyed. But I was a real stickler in terms of standards and providing the best service possible, which I continue to try and do in the role that I do now.

Kay So it sounds very much like your profile well resonated with you but kind of shone a light on the fact of the types of roles and careers that you've been attracted towards. You know during that time.

Rachel Absolutely and I think, yeah. And the aspects, both the sectors, but also the aspects of the job that I enjoy. So, in the last 15 years I've worked in education and, higher education and been a, a lecturer. And I've really enjoyed that, that aspect and that sector, around supporting others in terms of learning and education. And also being a facilitator and coach, it's for me, it's all around development and people development and supporting others and providing that learning environment. And building relationships with others again, I think is really key to my PRINT® profile. And also a part of my work. Well, a large part of my work working in the higher education sector as a lecturer has been working with health organisations, and again, with people that are similar to me. So actually wants to support or there's a really, you know, key to sort of building relationships with others and with patients and so forth. So I think there's a real fit. There's a real fit as well with the sector that I've worked in over the years.

Kay: Yeah I think alignment is an interesting thing, isn't it, of where you get something that absolutely, like you say, suits you when you recognise that, but also then threads all the way through your work. Can you give us a little bit of an idea around how you integrate PRINT® into you, well the practice that you've done currently, and maybe previous learning and development pieces that you've been and working with.

Rachel: Definitely. Yeah. I mean, I've tried to integrate it everywhere because I'm a big believer of it. And I'm not just saying that because I'm on the PRINT® podcast, but I genuinely do believe it to have so many strengths. So I integrate it in many ways in my capacity as a lecturer. I incorporate it in postgraduate programs in terms of leadership programs. Which is incredibly valuable in terms of understanding ourselves, but also understanding ourselves as a leader, and increasing our self-awareness and emotional intelligence. So I included it as part of postgraduate programs. I also include it as part of bespoke leadership programs as a facilitator. So typically I would include PRINT® on the first day of a leadership program. So there's then opportunity, if it's a three day program, to really embed that learning through the rest of the program. Key to coaching. As a coach, it's a really helpful one to one tool to really again enhance awareness of who we are. Our best selves and sometimes those shadow selves that creep in. So there's postgraduate programs, there's bespoke leadership programs, there's coaching and also, I work with PRINT® a lot in relation to working with teams. So teams in TAC teams that work together, and I think that is particularly valuable actually, for teams that are working together day in, day out and have been over a long period of time. I think it's really, really, really valuable in terms of getting to know each other better and improving those relationships with each other. And also recognising where sometimes there's a rub or there's a, there's a kind of tension. And recognising the breadth of profiles in teams. And actually, you know, sometimes there's a tension between different profiles. And that's not about, you know, taking it personally, but just recognising that we're different. So it's really, really helpful for that.

Kay: I think it's interesting you talk about emotional intelligence and that awareness. Can you give us a little bit more insight into how PRINT® can really help individuals and teams with their emotional intelligence and dialling that up?

Rachel: Yeah. I mean, I think in the first instance the self-awareness bit is really important. So, celebrating who we are, recognising and identifying our strengths, recognising our whole selves. So the self-awareness are the bits where, you know, the best self, the shadow aspects that maybe sometimes creep in and having that awareness and building that awareness. I think the other key part of emotional intelligence is around the sort of self-management aspect of ourselves. So, particularly so with PRINT® when we're thinking about some of those triggers and aspects that that might trigger us and we may potentially fall into shadow, it's not a given that we will, but we may. It allows us to kind of think about our reaction to difficult situations and how we how we manage that and manage our triggers. And it thinks about our emotions that underpin those triggers as well I think.

Kay : Yeah and I think it's not only about you, it's about recognising the emotions and responding to the emotions of others isn't it as well.

Rachel : Absolutely.

Kay: So that real kind of, both sides of the coin if you like around how do we support other people to stay in their best self. And what do we recognise might set them off, for example.

Rachel: And I suppose it’s that dual responsibility isn’t it. And I think, you know when we are, when we might be frustrated, triggered, whichever word we use, I think with PRINT® it's really helpful for us to understand what's underneath that. So, you know, sometimes when we're frustrated or we might be triggered by somebody else, it might be quite a visceral reaction. It might be quite a strong reaction. But actually, you know, what's underneath that is almost sort of surfacing it and being able to talk about it, I think which is, which is really important.

Kay: What do you think integrating PRINT® has added to your programs? Because it sounds very much like a) you've used it in, you know, a variety of sectors but also from different angles. What do you think it's kind of added?

Rachel: I think it's very popular, almost breeds itself in some way. So when teams of done PRINT®, the other teams actually want to be a part of it and actually asked to be asked to do it. It's, as I say, it's provided a point of difference. I know how much of a positive impact it has because obviously feedback in terms of PRINT® sessions. And PRINT® is always talked about. You know, PRINT® and the work I do it’s often really at the forefront of what people talk about in terms of what they've learned about themselves and the teams. I think the other the other thing that I really like about PRINT® is the environment that it brings about in terms of the fun as well. It's serious, but it can have an element of fun to it. And I think for me, being the people developer, and learning being at the core of what I do, it's actually really important to make learning light as well. And serious at times. But to actually have fun when you're in that sort of facilitation place and working with teams. So, I like that as well. So lots of things. Lots of things.

Kay : Yeah and it creates the right environment for learning doesn't it. It creates that environment where people are ready to be open and consider, do some reflection, think about what is what is relevant for them. Because beyond that session then it's down to them. And it's lovely to hear that it creates that common language. It creates that, you know, remembering what it is, but also the application. Now, I know that the profile, there's a number of different elements that you get within the profile. Do you have a favourite bit in that report that you really love, or you use more than anything else?

Rachel: I like to foreground the positive. I like to foreground the best self. I don't like the shadow as much. But I do actually, I do try to foreground the best self and to celebrate what everybody brings to the team to, you know, if it's an individual, what they bring to the personal, professional life, all aspects. So I actually think it's really important to promote that and to consider that. But that said, it's a whole report on it so it’s difficult. There are some really valuable learnings as well, you know, understanding what your triggers are. And working as well in pairs to see, you know, where you might be working with a completely different person that has got a completely different profile. That's really intriguing. So it's really difficult to say. And, and the other thing that we haven't talked about is the role alignment as well. So, you know, how best fit your unconscious motivators for the environment that you're working in. And is there a fit or if there isn't a fit, you know, what am I going to do about it? Because if I'm spending a lot of time in shadow and my Unconscious Motivators aren't being satisfied, then I'm not going to be fulfilled. I'm not going to be productive. I'm not obviously not going to be motivated. So there's so many insights. I mean, you know, it's quite a difficult question Kay.

Kay: You know it's that breadth of it, isn’t it? What difference do you think that it brings that kind of internal knowledge about yourself to the NHS or to a medical setting?

Rachel: I think it's really whole in terms of the difference it can make. I think it can make a difference to how we see ourselves in our private life. But on a professional level, which is what you're referring to Kay, I think, you know, how we manage ourselves. You know if we’re triggered for example, how we manage ourselves in order to minimize the amount of time where we might be in shadow self. So it affects us personally, because actually living a life in shadow is not a happy place to be. So it's about our own wellbeing and understanding ourselves better. It obviously affects relationships with each other, and the wider teams. And I think actually it's pretty far reaching and, and you know, when I'm, looking at assessments and student assessments as part of the work that I've done, my university work, you can actually see how students have actually reflected more broadly as well, leadership style and even their interaction with patients as well. So from a kind of impact perspective, you can either, I can read it or I can hear it. And there's so much of that.

Kay : So beyond discovery it sounds very much like your leadership programs are really, really broad and quite large. I mean a post graduate program I would imagine you're going to real depth aren't you. So beyond discovery, you know, what might be some of the other types of programs that you run with your, delegates that are linked to PRINT®, but take them into a down a different pathway?

Rachel : I do and so the discovery session, obviously the first stage of understanding PRINT® and the report and the language. And then working with teams, I often recommend adding the sort of modular aspects to PRINT® around communication, around managing change and responding to change. And also when I'm working with teams, working with looking at the team profiles. So, you know, yes, we've got our PRINT® profile and our individual PRINT® profile, but how does this show up as a whole in terms of what are the split of profiles amongst the team. And that's really helpful. That's, you know, considering, okay, you know, especially where we've got lot of the team are the same profile. And actually recognising where you might, you know, where if there's less, perhaps, you know, succeed and achieve and strong and self-reliant, less sort of action, focused. Not saying that the other profiles aren't action focused, but, you know, thinking about how we bridge that gap. So thinking about the strengths, but also thinking about what might be missing and what do we need to do? How do we need to behave differently? What do we need to be aware of? So the team session is, is really valuable for that. I mean, I think a personal favourite. And actually, from the feedback that I've received, a favourite of teams, in TAC teams, in the work that I do, I think is the communication module and thinking how our PRINT® profile might influence how we communicate. So, you know, just thinking about some profiles might want less communication, perhaps not bothered about the warmth and the communication and may just want a written email. You know, how are you? Have you had a nice holiday but might just cut to the chase, in terms of, you know, have you completed the report yet? Whereas other people, the relationship is important and the communication reflects how somebody appreciates and values you. So actually it is important, for example, in an email to say, you know, how are you? Did you have a nice weekend? Perhaps picking out some personal information. And that's not to say that there's a right and wrong there, but I think we can learn from all profiles about communication and what's important and also develop the skills of communication. So if it's not something that we value, we've also got to value that, you know, acknowledge that somebody else does value it. So if somebody else values it in the team, it's important to make it happen because we don't want to demotivate others. We don't want to trigger others. So there's lots around skills development about communication. You know is it written? Is it verbal? Is it face to face? You know, is it lots of stuff, you know, depending on the conversation, how important that conversation is, you know, is it email? Is it face to face? There's lots of conversations around that.

Kay: And I think I think that's a really interesting point because I would imagine in an organisation like an NHS trust, you know communication is so fundamental to how that runs, to how relationships are built, to how you communicate with each other within a team, to the patients, to the families. All those things that, you know, we kind of take for granted don’t we, about how we verbally communicate, written communication and how we also listen to others. And I think sometimes we take that for granted, but that depth of real understanding and shift and change in how we do that can make the difference. Have you had any feedback from any of your delegate? So anybody that's been on any of your programs arounds the difference it's made to them and any differences that they've made to their own way of being or communicating?

Rachel: We see sort of verbal feedback throughout sessions, but obviously sort of evaluations provide some really useful insights as well. So I think some of the themes are around that sort of individual insight, on an individual level. Som certainly recognising some of those triggers, celebrating strengths that, you know, as we've talked about, the self-awareness piece is really valuable. And also about team relationships and actually, understanding each other at a deeper level. I think, quite honestly, that being face to face in team workshops often, you know, all the work that I do now and have done as much as I could since Covid, dare I mention, has been face to face. So, actually having time to really, understand each other at a deeper level and have that awareness because obviously, being unconscious motivators, we don't, you know, we don't surface that information. So actually having that information to surface allows each other to sort of understand each other at a deeper level. And of course, that means that people then don't always take things personally, but actually it might be about their PRINT® profile rather than, you know, seeing it on a personal level. And I think knowing individual profiles helps teams as well maybe think about distribution of work and projects has been another part of the feedback that's been valuable to teams. You know, thinking about our own wellbeing and, you know, individuals sort of feeding back how much time they spend in shadow or not. And actually what, you know, if they are in shadow quite a bit of the time, what's going on there for them. You know, so I think it's much so much valuable feedback that comes out. And actually the feedback and the evaluations are often very positive, which is really, well, generally very positive, which is really good to hear.

Kay: I know that you obviously one of your practices is around reflection. Can you share a little bit more about the practice that you do and how PRINT® aligns to that?

Rachel: Working in the education sector, reflection is obviously really an important part of, reflecting and that learning process. And I’m also a time to think facilitator actually, which is very much around encouraging people to think for themselves. So in terms of the way that I facilitate team workshops, if you like, it's very much about allowing everybody to have an opportunity to speak out loud and to share their experience, and have a voice, being very inclusive. And that's really an important part for me. So just being able to reflect on experience and I think that's where in addition to the discovery workshop, subsequent workshops are really valuable too. Because obviously our learning doesn't stop in the discovery workshop, but we can start to really pin down and reflect at a deeper level with building on that initial workshop. So doing the communication change and the team profiles really encourages teams to reflect at a deeper level and really get to grips with the PRINT® language as well, to really learn it and to learn about each other at a deeper level. But yeah, reflection, providing a thinking space is really essential for me as a facilitator to try and create that space and, and hopefully quite a cathartic experience as well for the people coming into the room that they feel that they have a safe space to be able to talk freely about things as well.

Kay: Yeah I love that. You know it's the fact of saying the discovery session, you know, once it's finished that's when you start your learning because that's the application piece isn't it? You've had time to think and now it's, you know, what do you now do? What's the application? What's the practical elements that you can take out of it that you can then do for yourself, which I think beautifully connects all of those things together. Emotional intelligence, your reflection, that depth of of understanding. Wonderful. Thank you so much for sharing. So I have a little question around, in the spirit of sharing best practice, what could others learn from you? Well, you know, what would be your golden nuggets or pearls of wisdom that you might like to share with either other facilitators or the coaches out there, or people that are just listening in for the first time about PRINT®.

Rachel: I think from a learning perspective around PRINT®, I think one of the things I would say is at the beginning, you think you're never going to be able to recite 1 to 9 unconscious motivators. And I think quite sadly now, I can recite them very easily, in my sleep. I think as well, as a facilitator, if you're facilitating sessions, is there's very rarely times were others have not liked PRINT®. But there has been the odd time when, you know, they might have read through and looked at their shadow self and thought, you know, this isn't me, and can sometimes be quite defensive about it. And obviously sometimes just resting in that space and just saying, you know, we'll see, let’s keep talking, let’s keep working through it. And then they might see their triggers and think actually, yeah, this is me, I recognise myself, here sort of thing. So there's a bit of trust. There's a bit of, you know, everyone's got a shadow self, potential shadow self. So if there's ever a sort of negative reaction to it just stay with it. And you know, generally I've, you know, there's very little scepticism to be honest. Generally people enjoy it. So as a facilitator or a coach, enjoy it with them.

Kay: I love that. Enjoy it with them. Because I don't know about you, but I find every time I facilitate or coach or debrief someone, I learn something new every time because it's about them as a, as an individual and as a unique human being.

Rachel: Yeah. Absolutely. It’s intriguing isn’t it? It really is. And I think learning it on a personal level over 10 years, it still makes me think about myself in relation to situations and communication and so forth. And my professional and personal self, you know, I'm always linking and connecting to it in some way. So personally, it's been very valuable too.

Kay: So if you had to describe your unconscious motivators in whatever way you want to, what they mean to you and how they help you do what you do, how would you describe them?

Rachel: Well, I think I was trying to think of a metaphor Kay. I've moved on to a quote. So I was thinking about Maya Angelo, the American civil rights activist, and the quote might not be the verbatim here, but, she talks about, you don't necessarily remember what people say, you don't necessarily remember what people do, but you do remember how people make you feel. And I think that, for me, resonates with my profile because it is about connection and it is about people. And supporting others and helping others. So that kind of makes me, sort of resonates really with my with my profile.

Kay : I think I think you've I think you've got it pretty close there Rachel. What she, what her quote is. And you know, we've worked together for many years, haven't we? And you know, and I would absolutely agree with how you've described your unconscious motivators and what you do because I’ve loved working with you and, you know, seeing how you deliver PRINT® in your wonderful way. So the last couple of questions, you know, if people want to get in contact with you or hear more about what you do, how might they do that?

Rachel: LinkedIn, Kay, I think is the best one. So Rachel Martin @ RM Consulting. So absolutely, yeah, please connect in and I'd love to have conversations about PRINT® and the opportunities to work with all the accredited PRINT® coaches. Or people that might be thinking about becoming accredited, or more broadly, organisations as well that might be interested in having PRINT® for their teams as well.

Kay: And as I've already told you, we've got a little playlist. It's called our Now...Why? playlist. I'm inviting every one of our guests to contribute a song that is their motivational pick up. What do you go to when you're feeling in that place, that you want something to lift you up and drive you forward? So what song are you going to contribute to our list?

Rachel: I'm a bit of a runner, I enjoy running, and preferences to run with friends, because, of course it is. That's my PRINT® profile. But the other song that I played the other day, and is a regular on my playlist, is Step by Step, Whitney Houston.

Kay: And is that your running song?

Rachel Yeah, it’s quite useful when I’m halfway around and I want to stop. So, yeah, Step by Step, Whitney Houston. But don’t ask me to sing it for you, will you Kay?

Kay: No, no, not today. We'll put on the playlist and then you can sing along with all the other motivational songs. Wonderful. Well, thank you so much for joining us today. It's been an absolute pleasure. I've loved hearing about your practice, and giving you the opportunity to share your practice, you know, with others. And so thank you so much for all your, you know, the golden nuggets and the wisdom. It's been an absolute pleasure. Thank you everyone for listening. Please like and subscribe if you want to hear more podcasts and more wonderful coaches’ experiences of how they use that fabulous tool and how they motivate and drive other people. So that's it from me. Thanks very much. Take care. Bye bye.